[wp-hackers] Re: Blogroll, Bookmarks, Links?

Otto otto at ottodestruct.com
Tue Jun 26 13:49:52 GMT 2007

Marci: I read your links, and I disagree with your conclusions. Those
links support my position better than they do yours. :)

The link you provided to describe bookmarks has that information about
social bookmarks. These describe Wordpress's blogroll/bookmarks
functionality to the last detail. They are URL's which are stored for
easy access later, they are shared (you post them on your page), and
if you specifically look at this page which describes social
You'll find that social bookmarks are often categorized or tagged into
a folksonomy. It also describes how bookmarks often allow for more
than that, such as users rating them and such. While those specific
features are not currently in Wordpress, the point is that the social
bookmark is more than just a URL.

Contrarily, your page on hyperlinks does not describe Wordpress's
blogroll/bookmarks at all. You are correct that they are hyperlinks,
however you're looking only at the end product, not the process. All
a-href's are hyperlinks.

> bookmarks seems insufficient, since bookmarks (at least the ones I've seen
> so far) only do a handful of the things links can do.

Bookmarks can *always* do more than a simple link can. Here's a simple link:
<a href="http://example.com">Link</a>

But that's just the END RESULT of what Bookmarks do. I want Wordpress
Bookmarks to have tags. I want them to be displayable in a dozen
different ways. I want them to have the functionality and the features
and the capabilities of "social bookmarks". That's the point here.
They have some of that functionality already. Relegating them back to
simple "links" is doing a disservice to Wordpress and a disservice to
the Wordpress user community.

Advance. Not retreat.

> If we call them Links on the admin tab, I think MOST users, even the total
> newbies, will KNOW intuitively what they are for, because everyone knows
> what a link is. There will be fewer support requests, not more.

Demonstrably false. Look at the actual forum. Look at the history.
Mainly, look at the pre-2.1 requests. The confusion level went way
down just from changing it to "Blogroll". Okay, so there was a small
contingent that didn't like the change, but then there's always people
that don't like change.

> Bottom line: I'm not seeing Bookmarks as the correct term for what we have
> in WP. That they aren't "just plain hrefs" I definitely agree -- but denying
> they are "links" denies all that links have evolved into, and elevates
> bookmarks to a status they haven't really earned.

All links have not evolved. A link in a post has no metadata on the
backend. It's just a link. It doesn't have the capability of being
sorted by the last updated time, for example. It cannot point out an
RSS feed to a site as well as pointing to the site itself.

A Bookmark is a link *with supporting backend code*. It's not just an
a-href with rel tags and such.

> I think it also creates
> unnecessary end-user confusion, and more frustration for newbies trying to
> learn WP.

On the contrary, it creates less user confusion (as you'd *see* if you
bothered to actually *look* at the history in the support forums), and
it makes it easier to associate the section with other services.
Bookmarks are similar to other social bookmarking services, like
del.icio.us. I'd like to see them become even more similar. I'd like
them to get more features and functionality.

If all you want to add is a link to your sidebar, use a Text widget
and HTML code. Why have the bookmarks section at all if you just want
that much functionality?

I'll give you another example:

On my own site, I don't have a lot of entries in the Blogroll. On the
left sidebar of my page, there's the Blogroll section. One thing you
may notice, if you look closely enough or often enough, is that the
entries there will reorder themselves. That's because I have a script
reading the RSS feeds of each entry in my Bookmarks, and updating the
"last update time" for the bookmarks. They are then displayed in order
by that last updated time. So the blogs with the most recent entries
will always be at the top of the list. Neat, huh?

Can "links" reorder themselves?

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