<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">This isn't pointed towards you, it's more of a rant I've had on my mind for a while, but...<div><br></div><div>Seeing as we're all *professionals* here I thought there was a purpose on this list to interact with others in a *professional* manner. This list is for professional work, but l don't see how being an absolutely anti-social jerk is in any way *professional*. If you don't like the fact that a few of us like to have a conversation every once in a while, then please, get off of the list. </div><div><br></div><div>Sure, I can understand that the "I get a large volume of email" excuse, but please, for the sake of us all, don't tell us to quiet down. You're on the list by choice. Networking is a very good thing, and you never know when you might be working with one of us or whether a potential client is going over these. </div><div><br></div><div>If you actually looked over the blog post, #10. It's the "Don't be a jerk" rule. Follow it next time.</div><div><br></div><div>But anyway, adding onto the conversation, that's a really great list. I mean, seriously, with the exception of the "Don't call us geeks" I've had to explain all of that to a few of my clients at least once.</div><div><br></div><div>I don't mind being called a geek. Deep down, all of us really are. There's a fine line between "computer geek" and "geek". We all don't post to 4chan all day long and attend hacking conferences. But we all have the same mentality; it's natural to the profession. And beyond that, people don't simply know what to brand us as. People don't say, "hey, Tom Brady is a really great athlete" they say "Hey, Tom Brady is a really great quarterback". </div><div><br></div><div>Just my two cents </div><div>-ac</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div><div>On 06/10/2008, at 2:19 AM, bj wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="margin-top: 5px; margin-right: 5px; margin-bottom: 5px; margin-left: 5px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); text-decoration: none; "><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; ">Speaking of all being pros, can we keep the noise down please? This list is for the posting of wordpress work requests. Period. If y'all wanna have a conversation about articles and geeks, start your own list.</div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts6" style="font-family: arial; color: rgb(0, 128, 128); ">-- </span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts6" style="font-family: arial; color: rgb(0, 128, 128); ">Ciao for now,</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts6" style="font-family: arial; color: rgb(0, 128, 128); "> bj </span><a class="rvts7" href="mailto:bj@kickasswebdesign.com" style="font-family: arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); text-decoration: underline; ">mailto:bj@kickasswebdesign.com</a></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><a class="rvts7" href="http://kickasswebdesign.com" style="font-family: arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); text-decoration: underline; ">http://kickasswebdesign.com</a></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts6" style="font-family: arial; color: rgb(0, 128, 128); ">Sunday, October 5, 2008, 11:13:13 AM, you wrote:</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div><table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="2" style="font-size: 9pt; font-family: Verdana; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); text-decoration: none; "><tbody><tr valign="top"><td width="12" style="background-color: rgb(0, 0, 255); "><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts8" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: tahoma; font-weight: bold; color: rgb(255, 255, 255); background-color: rgb(0, 0, 255); ">></span></div></td><td width="801" style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); "><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts9" style="font-family: tahoma; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); ">I don't mind being called a geek.. It seems to me to be sort of a badge of honor. :) I have one customer who constantly writes and refers to me as a "computer geek type," and I've never taken it badly. I think he says it with envy. ;) Lots of others have said it from time to time to, and I can't remember a time that I was ever offended.</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts9" style="font-family: tahoma; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); ">Cary Briel</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; ">--</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; ">Skaneateles Design</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; "><a href="mailto:briel@skaneatelesdesign.com">briel@skaneatelesdesign.com</a></span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; ">(315) 685-2492</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts11" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: tahoma; ">Visit us at: </span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><a class="rvts12" href="http://www.skaneatelesdesign.com/" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: tahoma; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); text-decoration: underline; ">http://www.skaneatelesdesign.com</a></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; ">Also check out:</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><a class="rvts13" href="http://www.skaneatelestalk.com/" style="font-family: tahoma; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); text-decoration: underline; ">http://www.skaneatelestalk.com</a><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; "> </span></div><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; "> </span></p><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts11" style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: tahoma; "> </span></p><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><hr noshade="" size="2" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts14" style="font-family: tahoma; font-weight: bold; ">From:</span><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; "> <a href="mailto:wp-pro-bounces@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro-bounces@lists.automattic.com</a> [<a href="mailto:wp-pro-bounces@lists.automattic.com">mailto:wp-pro-bounces@lists.automattic.com</a>] </span><span class="rvts14" style="font-family: tahoma; font-weight: bold; ">On Behalf Of </span><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; ">David Coveney</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts14" style="font-family: tahoma; font-weight: bold; ">Sent:</span><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; "> Sunday, October 05, 2008 5:15 AM</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts14" style="font-family: tahoma; font-weight: bold; ">To:</span><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; "> <a href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a></span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts14" style="font-family: tahoma; font-weight: bold; ">Subject:</span><span class="rvts10" style="font-family: tahoma; "> [wp-pro] How to Hire a Pro</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><br></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">A while back I suggested I could write a guide on hiring a professional and lots of people said ‘yes!’. It followed a number of wp-pro requests that were pretty low-ball, unprofessional and denigrated the skills of the people on this list.</span></div><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; "> </span></p><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">Finally I’ve written a ‘lite’ version: </span><a class="rvts7" href="http://liverpoolwebdesigner.com/2008/10/04/if-you-want-to-hire-a-professional-act-like-one/" style="font-family: arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 255); text-decoration: underline; ">http://liverpoolwebdesigner.com/2008/10/04/if-you-want-to-hire-a-professional-act-like-one/</a></div><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; "> </span></p><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">Unfortunately what I’ve not had time to do is to write a full ‘how to specify WordPress work’ article, but I’m hoping to do that in the near future as a guideline for potential clients. In the above I do raise a few points along the lines of how a mockup doesn’t constitute a full design document, for example.</span></div><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; "> </span></p><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">Hopefully it’s helpful. It might seem a bit testy, but other developers so far seem to relate well to the issues I put across.</span></div><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; "> </span></p><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">All the best everyone and good luck in both hiring pros, and being hired by them :o)</span></div><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; "> </span></p><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">Dave Coveney</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">Interconnect IT</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; ">+44 (0)151 709 7977</span></div><div style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts15" style="font-family: arial; "><a href="http://www.interconnectit.com">http://www.interconnectit.com</a></span></div><p style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 0px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><span class="rvts16" style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman'; "> </span></p></td></tr></tbody></table></div>_______________________________________________<br>wp-pro mailing list<br><a href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a><br><a href="http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro">http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro</a><br></div></span></blockquote></div><br></div></div></body></html>