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I just have to say something on this subject.<br>
<br>
First my experience: I have had an overall positive experience with
this list. As a new startup, I don't have an extensive portfolio list
to point to since my former employer owns that work. So I've found this
list to be an invaluable resource for generating my initial client base.<br>
<br>
Now for feedback from a new client: One of my recently-found clients
from this list told me that most of the responses he received were from
people outside the US, and he really felt comfortable with me due to my
response and the fact that I was within a couple time zones.<br>
<br>
As for this list, I can't help but feel that the constant complaining
does nothing but serve to scare away some of the better clients. If I
were looking for work on this list, I would add myself and watch the
list for a few days. If I saw what I've been seeing for the past week,
I'd be severely turned off.<br>
<br>
I understand that some people here are top-level professionals (I would
expect this group to be the minority and not the majority), but
frankly, most of the people asking for work here are not looking for
top-level work. They are looking for people who are willing to help
them with their project for the budget they have. Even if we created
all these "rules" that you must be willing to pay X number of dollars
per hour, you must put your budget in your subject line, etc, those
rules would rarely be noticed. Then the people who currently complain
would complain even more with torrents of responses saying, "read the
rules!"<br>
<br>
Something to keep in mind is that not everyone requesting work on this
list if from [fill in your country], and not everybody responding to
the requests is from [fill in your country]. This is an international
list with international members. So putting limits on who can and who
cannot send messages to this list will do nothing more than make this
list all-but-worthless. Besides, if someone makes a request and doesn't
receive any responses, a rational person would realize that either a)
no one is able to help them, b) there is a problem with what they are
willing to pay, or c) there is a problem with their project. If that
person sends another message asking why they didn't receive any
responses, we can then nicely tell them that the budget that they have
is below what we are able to work for and recommend that they seek help
on <a href="http://wordpress.org/support" target="_blank">wordpress.org/support</a>.<br>
<br>
One last issue with the notion of people with professional-level
budgets. Why turn to a list of unknown strangers with unknown
reputations and
abilities when you have the money to hire known professionals? People
with a budget like that typically have a contact that can do the work
for them, have a contact that knows who would be a good
designer/developer for the proejct, or can hire a big-name firm to do
the work for them. So please drop the fantasy that this list should be
exclusively for people with budgets of that level.<br>
<br>
My advice is this:<br>
<ul>
<li>If you are looking for someone to help you with your project, by
all means post your request here.</li>
<li>If you are looking for jobs to do for whatever reason and want to
watch this list, watch the list, filter through those that aren't worth
your time, and don't flame the person making the request. Flaming
people doesn't make you look professional and doesn't make this list
look professional. So, if you have a beef with the "quality" of the
requests coming through this list, either unsubscribe yourself or go
rant about it to someone/something that doesn't make us look
unprofessional.</li>
</ul>
tl;dr<br>
<br>
If you have a complaint about the "professionalism" of the requests
coming through, keep it to yourself or remove yourself from the list.
Complaining about it just serves to make us look unprofessional.
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Chris Jean
Developer
RealThemes.com</pre>
<br>
<br>
Miriam Schwab wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:55964d020806170100s53daad7l67bf62e1295ce71b@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">It seems to me that most of the postings on this list are
by people who
want to pay $5 an hour for "it won't take you long" kind of work.<br>
<br>
I'm
interested to know if anyone here has gotten any decent projects from
this list? If not, it may be worthwhile trying to figure out how to get
the idea across that this list consists of professionals with
professional level experience and pricing.<br>
<br>
OR...<br>
<br>
Here's another angle, just to be devil's advocate: I
have no idea how many people are on this list or where they're from,
but it's very possible that there are many subscribers from countries
where the cost of living is lower so the prices are lower, like India
and some of Eastern Europe. I think that we have to take them into
account, and the fact that cheap job postings benefit two sides: the
people seeking help who have minimal budgets; and the people who are
happy to get this type of work and feel that it is worth their while.<br>
<br>
Miriam<br>
<br>
---------------------<br>
<font color="#888888">Miriam Schwab<br>
illuminea marketing & media<br>
Office: +972.2.566.0297<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.illuminea.com/"
target="_blank">www.illuminea.com</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.wordpressgarage.com/"
target="_blank">www.wordpressgarage.com</a></font><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 10:49 AM, Manuel
Amador (Rudd-O) <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rudd-o@rudd-o.com">rudd-o@rudd-o.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">The
"price on the subject" idea is not bad. I think if we all agree to<br>
publicize it as /call it "budget" instead of price, it would make much
more<br>
sense.<br>
<br>
El Lunes 16 Jun 2008, Dan Milward escribió:<br>
> I agree with you too. Hence my suggestion of having price in the<br>
> subject.. then I don't have to waste time reading jobs that don't<br>
> interest me. but meh. Whatever. I won't loose any sleep over this
:))<br>
><br>
> Ciao,<br>
><br>
> Dan<br>
><br>
> Michael Martine wrote:<br>
> > If an offer is too low I just ignore it. If somebody wants to
work for<br>
> > that little money, they are welcome to go for it. No big deal.<br>
> ><br>
> > On Mon, Jun 16, 2008 at 10:28 PM, Stephen Singer<br>
> > <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stephenms@earthlink.net">stephenms@earthlink.net</a>
<mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stephenms@earthlink.net">stephenms@earthlink.net</a>>>
wrote:<br>
> ><br>
> > Tea<br>
> ><br>
> > I am sorry you feel this but as a professional you don't
need to<br>
> > use this as a forum. We are all are entitled to use this
service<br>
> > seeking professionals and if this insulting I am sorry
there are<br>
> > plenty other ways to get work. I am not asking you to
work for<br>
> > free. Like I said if you were looking for a free service
to get<br>
> > work then you should allow this kind of freedom instead of<br>
> > complaining. People who advertise for jobs usually pay
for such<br>
> > services or simply pay marketing people. As an artist I
do things<br>
> > not for much money and at times I am quite happy the work
is there.<br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > Stephen<br>
> ><br>
> > ----- Original Message -----<br>
> > *From:* Téa Brennan <mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:tea@linkartist.com.au">tea@linkartist.com.au</a>><br>
> > *To:* Stephen Singer <mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:stephenms@earthlink.net">stephenms@earthlink.net</a>><br>
> > *Cc:* <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:lawrence@krubner.com">lawrence@krubner.com</a> <mailto:<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:lawrence@krubner.com">lawrence@krubner.com</a>>
;<br>
> > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>
<mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>><br>
> > *Sent:* Monday, June 16, 2008 7:16 PM<br>
> > *Subject:* Re: [wp-pro] need ] Need to hire wordpress
web<br>
> > developer and marketing<br>
> ><br>
> > Actually, wp-pro is for legitimate, paid Wordpress
work by<br>
> > professionals.<br>
> ><br>
> > It's not Craig's List, where you can expect to get
web design<br>
> > for bargain basement prices by a kid in his Mum's
basement.<br>
> ><br>
> > From the info page: "A list for professional
consultants<br>
> > providing WordPress services."<br>
> ><br>
> > If you're looking to throw "a few hundred bucks if
this works"<br>
> > -- that is insulting to every professional on this
list.<br>
> ><br>
> > I too am tiring of this.<br>
> ><br>
> > --<br>
> > Téa Brennan<br>
> > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.linkartist.com.au" target="_blank">www.linkartist.com.au</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.linkartist.com.au"
target="_blank">http://www.linkartist.com.au</a>><br>
> ><br>
> > On 17/06/2008, at 10:04 AM, Stephen Singer wrote:<br>
> >> Dear Lawrence,<br>
> >><br>
> >> This is the Internet not some agency for Web
Developers or<br>
> >> some exclusive club. If you are not interested
you don't<br>
> >> need to respond<br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >> Stephen<br>
> >><br>
> >><br>
> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lawrence
Krubner"<br>
> >> <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:lkrubner@geocities.com">lkrubner@geocities.com</a>
<mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:lkrubner@geocities.com">lkrubner@geocities.com</a>>><br>
> >> To: "Stephen Singer" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stephenms@earthlink.net">stephenms@earthlink.net</a><br>
> >> <mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:stephenms@earthlink.net">stephenms@earthlink.net</a>>><br>
> >> Cc: <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
> >> <mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>>><br>
> >> Sent: Monday, June 16, 2008 7:01 PM<br>
> >> Subject: Re: [wp-pro] need ] Need to hire
wordpress web<br>
> >> developer and marketing<br>
> >><br>
> >>> Stephen Singer wrote:<br>
> >>>> Please check out my website <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.kikachannel.com"
target="_blank">www.kikachannel.com</a><br>
> >>>> <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.kikachannel.com" target="_blank">http://www.kikachannel.com</a>><br>
> >>>> this is a free online concert video of
famous artists like<br>
> >>>> Chaka Khan, Four Tops, Tanya Tucker The
idea here is to<br>
> >>>> make money with advertising etc Already
have the player etc<br>
> >>>> and a website going<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> What I need is to list each artist and to be
able to link t<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> >his to another page where there will be
info on the artist<br>
> >>> >plus you play the full length concert and
bios, photos etc<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> I will link<br>
> >>> Amazon, Ebay on this page to sell<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> >products and other companies. I am
working with<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.Brightcove.com" target="_blank">www.Brightcove.com</a>
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.Brightcove.com"
target="_blank">http://www.Brightcove.com</a>> I<br>
> >>> am uploading<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> >these full length concerts in high
quality to see full<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> concerts which<br>
> >>> are about a hour long. I<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> >need some who has a background in video
marketing, website<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> developer<br>
> >>> and word press and the<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> >ability to market this on the WEB.
Willing to give a few<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> hundred<br>
> >>> dollars for the project and some back end<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> >money if this works and starts making
money. I realize this<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> is not a<br>
> >>> much of a budget but honestly this<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> >is quite speculative. The great thing is
I have tons of<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> videos of<br>
> >>> these legendary acts.<br>
> >>><br>
> >>>> Please contact me via e-mail or (818)
991-9347<br>
> >>>> Stephen Singer<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> What is going on with the WP-Pro list? We've
had an epidemic<br>
> >>> lately of people asking for free or nearly
free help. Can we<br>
> >>> get some moderation on this list? It would
nice to limit<br>
> >>> this list to requests from clients who are
serious.<br>
> >>><br>
> >>><br>
> >>> -- lawrence krubner<br>
> >><br>
> >> _______________________________________________<br>
> >> wp-pro mailing list<br>
> >> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>
<mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>><br>
> >> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro"
target="_blank">http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro</a><br>
> ><br>
> > _______________________________________________<br>
> > wp-pro mailing list<br>
> > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>
<mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>><br>
> > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro"
target="_blank">http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro</a><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> ><br>
> > --<br>
> > Michael Martine<br>
> ><br>
> > Remarkablogger -<br>
> > Remarkable blog consulting and coaching<br>
> > Web: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.remarkablogger.com" target="_blank">http://www.remarkablogger.com</a><br>
> ><br>
> > Gateway Blogging-<br>
> > The web's only combination business and blog marketing
learning program<br>
> > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://gatewayblogging.com"
target="_blank">http://gatewayblogging.com</a><br>
> ><br>
> > Skype: michael.martine<br>
> > Phone: 802-659-4048<br>
> ><br>
> > Follow me on Twitter: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://twitter.com/remarkablogger" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/remarkablogger</a><br>
> ><br>
> > Collaborate and Manage Freelance Projects like a Pro with
Basecamp:<br>
> > possiblefraudstart "<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://basecamphq.com" target="_blank">basecamphq.com</a>"
possiblefraudend *MailScanner has<br>
> > detected a possible fraud attempt from "<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://basecamphq.com" target="_blank">basecamphq.com</a>"
claiming to<br>
> > be* <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://basecamphq.com?referrer=6EYUR72V4G" target="_blank">http://basecamphq.com?referrer=6EYUR72V4G</a><br>
> >
------------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
> ><br>
> > _______________________________________________<br>
> > wp-pro mailing list<br>
> > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
> > <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro"
target="_blank">http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro</a><br>
><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> wp-pro mailing list<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro"
target="_blank">http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
<br>
Manuel Amador (Rudd-O) <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rudd-o@rudd-o.com">rudd-o@rudd-o.com</a>><br>
Rudd-O.com - <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://rudd-o.com/"
target="_blank">http://rudd-o.com/</a><br>
GPG key ID 0xC8D28B92 at <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://wwwkeys.pgp.net/" target="_blank">http://wwwkeys.pgp.net/</a><br>
<br>
Now playing, courtesy of Amarok: Cascada - Everytime we touch<br>
After all, all he did was string together a lot of old, well-known
quotations.<br>
-- H. L. Mencken, on Shakespeare<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
wp-pro mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro"
target="_blank">http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro</a><br>
<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br>
<br clear="all">
<br>
-- <br>
---------------------<br>
Miriam Schwab<br>
illuminea marketing & media<br>
Tel: (02) 566.0297<br>
Cell: 054.571.0624<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.illuminea.com">www.illuminea.com</a>
<pre wrap="">
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wp-pro mailing list
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</pre>
</blockquote>
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