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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>While I think Tim was a little hasty in
his response, I do understand his point.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>$10 isn’t much. Installing or
upgrading WP isn’t a difficult job either… but it can be! With
clients who want a WP service hosted on our machines we charge nothing for the
setup because it’s so darned quick and easy. But if it’s going on
their server… we have to say it’ll be an hourly charge. I’ve
had one install eat a whole day in time because the server turned out to be set
up incorrectly and the hosts needed talking through it all. Then add on
billing, accounting for the payment (a pro has to do accounting, no choices!)
and maybe chasing it up…<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Already it looks like it’s a
troublesome job – if you follow the instructions WP should take a few
minutes to get going. So that’s a sign of problem number one –
perhaps it’s taking time because there’s a server issue? There’s
a good chance this could end up eating an afternoon of time.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Then what happens? Are you stuck at $10
because you agreed a fixed cost job? If you ask for more in the event of
problems do you then get slated on the forums? What if the server is
incompatible? Ultimately, for most professionals, it simply isn’t worth
the risk to their company’s/own reputation.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The vast majority of times I keep quiet on
this conference because a fair proportion of the requests do indeed appear to
be from people hoping for a very cheap job – often at a fixed price.
Because of the risks inherent, a real pro simply can’t do that. It doesn’t
help us that the value of the dollar has dived either, being based in <st1:place
w:st="on">Europe</st1:place>. I’ve sometimes felt that this mailing list
should be called “wp-users-in-search-of-people-who-would-like-to-be-professional-soon-and-know-a-lot-but-need-to-get-a-foot-on-the-first-rung-of-the-ladder-and-therefore-more-willing-to-take-risks”
But that would be harder to remember ;o)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>But there’s an answer – if you
can’t set up and manage a WordPress installation, and aren’t going
to be able to afford to pay someone in the future, then WordPress.com is your
friend. Everything’s nicely automated, protected, and locked down. Your
chances of a major problem with your blog are significantly reduced. You can
even then pay a pro to do a styling job on your blog, if required – and it’s
impressive what can be done.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>We often get people turning up at our
office with a £200 budget for a custom design and we just point them at
WordPress.com. It’s not worth even trying too hard to do custom work at
that level because they’re often (but not always!) the most troublesome
customers, with the least research behind them and the most questions. That
gets expensive – especially when it means that better paying clients are
having to wait.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>So Tim had a point – perhaps just a
bit harshly put. You had a point too :o)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Can we all play nicely now? If you don’t
see a job you don’t want… just leave it be!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Cheers!<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Dave.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:12.0pt;
color:windowtext'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma;color:windowtext;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 color=black face=Tahoma><span lang=EN-US style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;color:windowtext'> wp-pro-bounces@lists.automattic.com
[mailto:wp-pro-bounces@lists.automattic.com] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On
Behalf Of </span></b>Jordon Bedwell<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> 21 February 2008 07:49<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> Tim Kissane; WP-Pro<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: [wp-pro] 2 WP
Installs for 10 bucks</span></font><font color=black><span lang=EN-US
style='color:windowtext'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>WTF. Dude. Calm
down. It would only take 10 minutes and if you call yourself a
professional and can't do two upgrades in 10 minutes quit your job because you
fail... I believe at your hourly wages for Wordpress he would be over paying
you for the 10 minutes. Whip out that fancy TI-86 you never learned to
program and calculate it. If you need me to teach you how to program
a TI-86 go ahead and call me, I'll teach you - also, if you need me to
teach you to add and subtract get at me too. Perhaps he should offer your
actual wage. $7.5 for the 10 minutes. Not that you are worth it since you
are the typical "I am an elitest" type of guy.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>On another note, with a
site like yours, you shouldn't be designing shit, it looks like your site is
stuck in 1999. *Whips out Prince CDs and starts playing 1999*. You NEED
to go back to art school and learn what design is. Maybe fix some of the
problems on your site. "var AdBrite_Title_Color = '006600'; var
AdBrite_Text_Color = 'ffffff'; var AdBrite_Background_Color = '7da6da'; var
AdBrite_Border_Color = '7da6da';" - about_us.html, maybe you could even
help me figure out why the hell a commercial site that offers services such as
yours would have adverts on their site? Very professional, I would hire you at
$5.65 an hour, and only for a pee-on job pulling tape drives from servers for a
client.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>You are far from a pro Mr.
Kissane. A few questions Mr. "Professional":</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>1.) WTF is "</<span
class=end-tag>ulpt</span><span class=attribute-name> type</span>=<span
class=attribute-value>"text/javascript"</span>>" - I suggest
you get that fixed before you look like a moron who charges $45 an hour to
horribly misspell script.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>2.) Why are you lying to
your customers? <a
href="http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Ftimbury.net%2Ftcs%2Fabout_us.html">http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Ftimbury.net%2Ftcs%2Fabout_us.html</a></span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>3.) For somebody who
promotes to be a pro, why are you still using HTML 4.0 and how the hell do you
manage to mess up HTML 4.0? That has to be the most ill-semantic, easy to do
language in the world.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>a.) I've seen 11th graders
in graphics design skills build better HTML. Sad, but true.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>Now, I know my site isn't
perfect and nobodies is, but nobody talks about how great they are and makes
that many mistakes. Especially while demanding they are worth so much but
have made intern mistakes. I hope you've enjoyed my professional opinion on the
subject.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>Yours truly,</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Trebuchet MS"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Trebuchet MS"'>en-US.EnvyGeeks.Com</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>----- Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div style='font-color:black'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=2 color=black
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href="mailto:tim@timbury.net" title="tim@timbury.net">Tim Kissane</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href="mailto:shaunconnell@gmail.com" title="shaunconnell@gmail.com">Shaun R.
Connell</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Cc:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com" title="wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> Thursday,
February 21, 2008 12:34 AM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 color=black face=Arial><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font
size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> Re:
[wp-pro] 2 WP Installs for 10 bucks<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>I've subscribed to this list for a month. It's funny. <br>
So many cheapskates that want to pay fast food wages <br>
for tech skills they obviously lack themselves. Every other post<br>
says "shouldn't take more than 10 minutes" or "it's basic, but I<br>
don't have the time myself" or some such malarkey. <br>
<br>
I'm a computer professional with 25 years experience. I get<br>
$150./hour as a consultant. Because WordPress work is less<br>
demanding than network management, I charge $45./hour for<br>
themes and $75./hour for backend stuff. <br>
<br>
My advice to you, Mr. Connell: find some 14 year old to jump<br>
at your 10 bucks and keep your fingers crossed. Or learn to<br>
do it yourself. Then, when you've f*cked it up royally, cough<br>
up some money and hire a pro.<br>
<br>
Tim Kissane<br>
<br>
<br>
Shaun R. Connell wrote: <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>I know it shouldn't take more than 10 minutes, but I
still need help with the installs. :P I'll pay 10 bucks for two installs
-- same host.<br clear=all>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<pre style='text-align:center'><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'>
<hr size=4 width="90%" align=center>
</span></font></pre><pre><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span
style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>wp-pro mailing list<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><a
href="mailto:wp-pro@lists.automattic.com">wp-pro@lists.automattic.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><a
href="http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro">http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<pre><font size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>-- <o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Tim Kissane<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>Timbury Computer Services<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><a
href="http://timkissane.com/">http://timkissane.com/</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><a
href="http://timbury.net/">http://timbury.net/</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>732.604.3817<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>=========================<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'>"More hideous crimes have been committed in the name of obedience than in the name of rebellion." -- CP Snow<o:p></o:p></span></font></pre><pre><font
size=2 color=black face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></pre>
<div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3
color=black face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
<hr size=2 width="100%" align=center>
</span></font></div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 color=black face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt'>_______________________________________________<br>
wp-pro mailing list<br>
wp-pro@lists.automattic.com<br>
http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-pro<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</blockquote>
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