[wp-hackers] hierarchical custom taxonomies vs good & old cats.

[Haluk Karamete]

>>Okay, the problem here is that you've gone too specific. You wouldn't
define People->Politicians->Obama in a sane taxonomy. You might define
People->Politicians, but that's as far as you'd go with it. [That's point X]

Yes absolutely.


>>Obama is a specific instance, whereas your taxonomy contains things that are
broad categories.

Thats's right as well.

>>Let's say your taxonomy is "people". In that case, yes, it would
absolutely make sense to add obama to it, probably as a tag. But it
would not make sense to add "politicians" to that taxonomy.

That's also right.

>>A taxonomy is a group of like terms. And that's important: LIKE terms.
"obama" is not like "politicians", because "obama" is a specific thing
while "politicians" is a group of things.

Otto, that is true. but that's in theory. At the end of the day, don't
we want this though?

<b>People: </b>
<a href='get all the politicians posts under the people-group
taxonomy'>Politicians</a>,
<a href='get all the obama posts under the people taxonomy'>obama</a>

Cleanly written that's basically

------------------------------------
People: Politicians, Obama
------------------------------------

where both Politicians and Obama is clickable to pull the proper posts
under the proper context. that's all there is to it. isn't it? the
point is how do we make easy for the people, the developers, the
average developers.

"People: Politicians, Obama" is what the joe the user, sees. Joe does
not care about what was a tag under the hood , or what came thru a
hierarchial taxonomy or what not. He clicks and go.
The internal stuff is for us & wp to worry about. Looking from this
angle, the question is what UI is needed to pull this off in the most
intuitive way.
That was my precise goal in discussing this thread. It made sense to
me to  implement it so that all the developer does is to crete a
hierarchial taxonomy called People and then throw proper terms under
it such as "Politicians","Musicians" etc and whenever he needs to tag
a post (with say M. Jackson, he goes straight into the
People/Musicians taxonomy, and  clicks on the musicians, lets the WP
open the textbox, and tags the item(s) such as
M.Jackson,R.Stewart,Madonna in one go like that. I thought, with that
approach, hw would end up doing 2 things in one shot.

1- classify the post as people/politicians custom taxonomy.
2- tag the post under politicians taxonomy.

Now, this action may appear to confuse you in understanding what I'm
saying and thus you can make the remarks you did with point X at the
top of this message - which I completely agree. In theory, you are
VERY VERY TRUE.

But if the UI I'm suggesting is going to do the following behind the
scenes, can we say we are on the same page?

WP creates "Musicians" taxonomy, ( that is on the fly and with
hierarchial=false ) and add Michael and Rod to it.

So, it is a UI issue. But I think it is a benefit to all.

Agree?

-and BTW, thanks to all who put up with me in these long treads.



On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 10:14 AM, Otto <otto at ottodestruct.com> wrote:
> Continuing:
>
> On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 11:08 AM, Haluk Karamete
> <halukkaramete at gmail.com> wrote:
>> "obama", "blair" and tons of many others can easily be grouped as
>> "politicians", thus the need for "politicians" as a group, as a
>> category.  ( And this satisfies your point 1 )
>
> But categories don't apply to those, because they are not posts.
>
> Terms in taxonomies actually get applied to posts, not to other terms.
> So yes, you can define obama and blair as being in a group, but the
> way you group terms is by wrapping a taxonomy around them. Not
> wrapping them up inside another term.
>
>> Wouldn't it be nice & easy for both the developers and the site
>> visitors to pull something like the following?
>>
>> <b>People: </b>
>> <a href='get all the politicians posts under the people
>> taxonomy'>Politicians</a<>,
>> <a href='get all the obama posts under the people taxonomy'>obama</a>"
>
> No, that wouldn't make any sense, because your taxonomy is too broad.
> This makes more sense:
>
> <b>People: </b>
> <a href='get all the politicians posts under the people-group
> taxonomy'>Politicians</a>,
> <a href='get all the obama posts under the people taxonomy'>obama</a>
>
> Because, again, terms apply to posts. Politicians and Obama are both
> "People", but they are not the same "type" as each other, and so
> shouldn't be in the same taxonomy.
>
> -Otto
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