[wp-hackers] IRC Meetup

[Robert Deaton]

Once again, here's the logs

May 11 16:04:28 photomatt 
http://codex.wordpress.org/IRC_Meetups#Suggested_Topics
May 11 16:04:37 photomatt still time to add things if there's anything 
anybody wanted to cover
May 11 16:04:51 photomatt just a brief catch-up from action items from last 
week
May 11 16:04:58 photomatt 1.5.1 was released
May 11 16:05:07 ryanduff yay!
May 11 16:05:10 photomatt no updates to the logo yet, but I hear *color* 
might be coming soon
May 11 16:05:20 jonabad oooooo
May 11 16:05:22 * westi|gone (~peter at alice.ftwr.co.uk<http://alice.ftwr.co.uk>) 
has joined #wordpress-meetup
May 11 16:05:27 * westi|gone is now known as westi
May 11 16:05:29 carthik okay, got my late edit in
May 11 16:05:31 RandyWalker w00t
May 11 16:05:38 photomatt haven't gotten to the action items for the forums 
yet, got caught up with life and release stuff
May 11 16:05:38 westi evening all
May 11 16:05:41 Pplproof I had something to add to that, actually.
May 11 16:06:03 photomatt Pplproof: yes?
May 11 16:06:25 carthik On the logo, I think this would be an easily 
reproduced, versatile, short logo : < WordPress />
May 11 16:06:30 photomatt also, didn't sell WordPress to Google this week
May 11 16:06:37 photomatt though I did look into the wp.com
<http://wp.com>domain from Yahoo
May 11 16:06:39 * Denis_de
(~chatzilla at m57.net195-132-116.noos.fr<http://m57.net195-132-116.noos.fr>)
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May 11 16:06:46 photomatt which is *significantly* out of our price range
May 11 16:06:57 skippy how much?
May 11 16:06:57 RandyWalker :\
May 11 16:06:59 * Tyler__
(~Tyler at Kingston-HSE-ppp3558323.sympatico.ca<http://Kingston-HSE-ppp3558323.sympatico.ca>)
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May 11 16:07:06 photomatt 1mm+
May 11 16:07:14 westi ouch
May 11 16:07:15 photomatt maybe post-IPO
May 11 16:07:15 twistedraisin dear lord
May 11 16:07:25 Firas we'll get it one day :D
May 11 16:07:26 photomatt however the transfer of
wordpress.com<http://wordpress.com>is pending
May 11 16:07:28 skippy pshaw. for two little lettes? Not even vowels...
May 11 16:07:37 Blackb|rd photomatt: mm being what? million $ US?
May 11 16:07:49 Pplproof Concerning the graphic elements, and being as I've 
never had a chance to touch base with anyone about it yet, are they 
something that's open to community contribution? My fianceee and I are both 
graphic artists by trade, and were looking to come up with some ideas, but 
weren't sure how long along in the process you were, or if you were open to 
"outside help".
May 11 16:07:54 photomatt Blackb|rd: didn't really get to exact figures, the 
range was already a bit high
May 11 16:08:00 Denis_de sorry for missing the start but... what is out of 
price range?
May 11 16:08:03 * ryanduff|laptop (~ryanduff|@
pcp09614033pcs.hershy01.pa.comcast.net<http://pcp09614033pcs.hershy01.pa.comcast.net>)
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May 11 16:08:04 * Heilemann
(~Michael at port607.ds1-by.adsl.cybercity.dk<http://port607.ds1-by.adsl.cybercity.dk>)
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May 11 16:08:06 Blackb|rd photomatt: jeez. "too expensive"
May 11 16:08:07 Firas Denis_de: wp.com <http://wp.com> domain
May 11 16:08:27 Blackb|rd Denis_de: price for wp.com <http://wp.com>. >=1e06 
$
May 11 16:08:40 RandyWalker lol
May 11 16:08:46 * Jason___
(~TheJason at dhcp80ff6702.dynamic.uiowa.edu<http://dhcp80ff6702.dynamic.uiowa.edu>)
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May 11 16:08:49 * Denis_de is now known as Semiologic
May 11 16:08:50 photomatt Pplproof: it's on its fifth iteration or so, so 
it's getting fairly close to what I think will be the final logo
May 11 16:09:06 MCincubus photomatt, derivatives of the first logos you 
showed?
May 11 16:09:07 photomatt we did have some other community submissions, all 
of which were quite good
May 11 16:09:10 Semiologic Blackbird -- i can imagine :)
May 11 16:09:12 photomatt but didn't fit the project as well
May 11 16:09:47 * ryanduff
(~ryan at pcp05146676pcs.reding01.pa.comcast.net<http://pcp05146676pcs.reding01.pa.comcast.net>)
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May 11 16:09:52 photomatt the new logo is going to be more of an evolution 
rather than a completely new aesthetic
May 11 16:10:00 carthik photomatt, consider < WordPress /> too, if you will 
- simple, and in keeping with Semantic, Standards Compliant etc...
May 11 16:10:16 photomatt carthik: we actually had a submission that did 
that! maybe I can forward it to you
May 11 16:10:17 masquerade carthik, note quite, it has uppercases
May 11 16:10:21 Firas carthik: too geeky.. and chained to xml
May 11 16:10:41 photomatt what I do hope to be able to do is be able to find 
uses for the submitted logos, even if they're not the main WP look
May 11 16:10:42 masquerade s/note/not
May 11 16:10:55 Pplproof How many entry-level users are really going to 
"Get" that...?
May 11 16:11:03 twistedraisin alternate logos for possible prepackaged 
themes, matt?
May 11 16:11:06 masquerade photomatt, maybe post them for public display, 
and let theme authors include one that matches their theme well?
May 11 16:11:12 carthik like 6A has the 6 dots and the wrench(spanner), more 
than one could be good. Not everyone has to get it immediately...
May 11 16:11:30 MCincubus carthik, yeah. And AOL and the "A" and the "buddy 
guy"
May 11 16:11:38 photomatt my fav logos are things like FedEx, with the 
hidden arrow
May 11 16:11:50 skeltoac I noticed that very recently
May 11 16:11:58 MCincubus ... I totally never saw that
May 11 16:12:01 Firas hehe, photomatt wants a WP logo that you can spot on a 
truck 200ft away :D
May 11 16:12:09 photomatt the latest mockup also got a favorable review 
here: http://jefte.net/articles/wordpress-releases-1-5-1-and-logo-previews/
May 11 16:12:15 photomatt Firas: yes, think billboards and blimps :)
May 11 16:12:42 Heilemann Holy crap... There's a hidden arrow in there! Hah! 
Cool :D
May 11 16:13:02 photomatt the next suggested topic was changing the channel, 
which we already did
May 11 16:13:03 Pplproof The best logos can used equally effective in B&W, 
and can be used at ANY size...
May 11 16:13:03 photomatt so yay!
May 11 16:13:04 relle Side of an airplane....
May 11 16:13:07 skeltoac Wait, that's still the latest mockup? Nothing 
newer?
May 11 16:13:09 skippy may I ask why the W has a "bulb" on the right end in 
the logo? It looks ... odd.
May 11 16:13:12 ryanduff|laptop c'mon matt, you know you want it changed to 
"werd press" :P
May 11 16:13:18 photomatt skeltoac: nothing since last week
May 11 16:13:19 photomatt word.
May 11 16:13:43 photomatt skippy: it symbolizes what big heads we all have
May 11 16:13:52 Firas yeah, if opinions are counted, the bulb seems out of 
place
May 11 16:13:55 ColdForged O_o
May 11 16:13:55 skippy I didn't think you noticed!
May 11 16:14:07 carthik word.
May 11 16:14:13 carthik nice^^
May 11 16:14:23 carthik move on, though.
May 11 16:14:33 masquerade I don't necessarily "like" the bulb, but I think 
if it was removed it would look a little plain
May 11 16:14:42 Firas Possibility of assigning "positions or areas of 
responsiblity" for coordindation of the various Codex activities and 
assignments. Lorelle 22:39, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
May 11 16:14:45 photomatt as to the next topic, I'm open to more 
submissions, but probably the best designer time would go toward themes or 
coordiation with plugin authors
May 11 16:14:50 ryanduff|laptop it needs something, just not a bulb
May 11 16:14:51 Pplproof photomatt: If we're moving on, that's a subject I'd 
like to discuss more in-depth with you, if possible.
May 11 16:15:06 photomatt Pplproof: not necessary, what did you have in 
mind?
May 11 16:15:41 Pplproof Well, I'm just thinking a new user's first 
impressions to the logo...
May 11 16:15:52 Pplproof Choice of fonts, for instance.
May 11 16:15:56 * chuyskywalker
(~chuy at 64-142-94-171.dsl.static.sonic.net<http://64-142-94-171.dsl.static.sonic.net>)
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May 11 16:16:10 kylev dude, XML-as-logo is sooooooo 2002!
May 11 16:16:11 Pplproof Sorry, slipping into "designer" mode here, so bear 
with me... ;)
May 11 16:16:40 Pplproof What sort of attitude are you trying to convey with 
it?
May 11 16:16:57 Pplproof "professional", "forward thinking", 
"progressive"...?
May 11 16:16:58 photomatt well if you look at logos in general
May 11 16:17:08 photomatt and logos of other companies/products in our space
May 11 16:17:12 Blackb|rd as fort the bulby W: it may become the "Wordpress 
W" which i turn makes it easy to have really tiny logos signifying WP stuff.
May 11 16:17:16 photomatt on one end you have blogger, ultra friendly
May 11 16:17:20 photomatt Blackb|rd: exactly
May 11 16:17:28 * Heilemann has quit ()
May 11 16:17:30 photomatt but Blogger is also a little comic-booky
May 11 16:17:37 photomatt they're like the Kia
May 11 16:17:45 photomatt we want to be the Lexus/Mercedes of blogging
May 11 16:17:48 MCincubus "Hey kids!!"
May 11 16:17:50 Pplproof Yes, they're designed to be ULTRA-accessible.
May 11 16:18:02 photomatt which I think is a good contrast to how FREE we 
are
May 11 16:18:04 relle photomatt: then the logo is perfect. The bulb in the 
middle looks like a car logo.
May 11 16:18:06 Pplproof You want to be the Lexus that still gets 50MPG...?
May 11 16:18:09 masquerade without the price
May 11 16:18:40 Blackb|rd and having decent typography also adds to a 
feeling of sophistication.
May 11 16:18:42 photomatt free but priceless
May 11 16:18:48 MCincubus The free Lexus that is yours to drive, if you 
don't mind a manual transmission.
May 11 16:18:50 factoryjoe photomatt: have you thought about the license on 
the font at all?
May 11 16:19:08 factoryjoe on problem with spreadfirefox was that everyone 
wants the FF Meta font...
May 11 16:19:18 factoryjoe which, b/c of copyright, we couldn't just give 
away...
May 11 16:19:22 photomatt factoryjoe: I'll probably end up buying it, I 
think it's < $30
May 11 16:19:23 factoryjoe mrs eaves is copyrighted
May 11 16:19:23 * h3h (prb at cpe-24-165-8-156.san.res.rr.com) has joined 
#wordpress-meetup
May 11 16:19:33 factoryjoe yeah, that's for your *your* license
May 11 16:19:40 relle he's right.
May 11 16:19:42 Firas oh i recognize factoryjoe
May 11 16:19:42 photomatt we could certainly distribute vectors of the logo
May 11 16:19:48 factoryjoe by comparison, the drupal font is open source
May 11 16:19:50 photomatt without sending out the whole font
May 11 16:19:51 Blackb|rd photomatt: I think he meant for the countless ppl 
who want do acfepress T-Shirts
May 11 16:19:56 MCincubus yeah. you can't copyright fonts. Only the font 
files, I think.
May 11 16:19:58 factoryjoe photomatt: that's one option
May 11 16:20:14 photomatt after this is done I want so much schwag no one 
will know what to do
May 11 16:20:16 factoryjoe just wanted to make a note of that...
May 11 16:20:19 carthik photomatt, that would be nice and maybe even 
necessary
May 11 16:20:27 skeltoac shwag => ditto
May 11 16:20:27 photomatt not cafepress, maybe real shirts
May 11 16:20:28 skippy I didn't mean to hang us up on the bulb. It just 
seems incongruently curvy on an otherwise rigid serif character.
May 11 16:20:39 Blackb|rd photomatt: 'course, but you got what I meant
May 11 16:20:51 relle skippy: that's the contrast effect - it's a good 
thing.
May 11 16:21:00 photomatt speaking of shirts
May 11 16:21:02 * westi wants shwag too
May 11 16:21:07 Pplproof I have to agree with skippy on this.
May 11 16:21:08 Blackb|rd skippy: well, WP makes a difference, doesn't it?
May 11 16:21:12 skippy it strikes me as discordant, more than contrast.
May 11 16:21:20 photomatt we got an email a few days ago from 
http://www.spreadshirt.com/
May 11 16:21:24 factoryjoe i'm w/ skippy... 
May 11 16:21:25 photomatt they want to promote themselves to bloggers
May 11 16:21:27 h3h where's the new logo?
May 11 16:21:27 factoryjoe what??!
May 11 16:21:37 Blackb|rd could be a smaller bulb, agreed.
May 11 16:21:41 MCincubus h3h, http://photomatt.net/temp/
May 11 16:21:56 relle photomatt: I personally (experienced voice here) like 
it. I didn't at first, but I see the potential. Bulb alone, words alone, all 
together, t-shirts, swatches, billboards - blogs, blogrolls, lots of 
versatility. Good work. Remember, a lot of work goes into these things, 
folks. And a lot of thought.
May 11 16:21:57 Blackb|rd photomatt: German Co., IIRC
May 11 16:22:03 h3h hmm. what's the significance of the bulb?
May 11 16:22:05 skeltoac Shrink that bulb too much, Blackb|rd, and you lose 
the distinctiveness that it needs.
May 11 16:22:06 photomatt please don't link to that URL in blogs, that is a 
temporary spot
**** ENDING LOGGING AT Wed May 11 16:22:18 2005

**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed May 11 16:22:33 2005

May 11 16:22:33 * Now talking on #wordpress-meetup
May 11 16:22:33 * Topic for #wordpress-meetup is: WordPress Weekly IRC 
Meetup | Wednesdays at 5PM EST
May 11 16:22:33 * Topic for #wordpress-meetup set by masq|coding at Wed May 
11 14:37:02 2005
May 11 16:22:41 Blackb|rd skippy: a complicated balance, agreed
May 11 16:22:48 carthik well what about spreadshirt, though, matt?
May 11 16:22:51 photomatt Opera uses spreadshirt for their US and EU stores
May 11 16:22:55 Pplproof The logo does a nice job of carrying that 
"professional" vibe, but it doesn't come across as very "accessible"... 
Serif fonts = Law firms, "elitist", etc.
May 11 16:23:14 Pplproof And it doesn't really have the distinction to stick 
in my mind.
May 11 16:23:22 photomatt and falls back to cafepress for other items
May 11 16:23:24 chuyskywalker wp_logo_4.00.gif -- makes me think of aviation 
for some reason. Wings, etc. 
May 11 16:23:25 westi from my experiences in doing t-shirts (I organised 
halls t-shirts at uni two years running) there pricing is reasonable too
May 11 16:23:36 photomatt westi: that's good to know
May 11 16:23:54 Semiologic personally i like the current logo. why in the 
world do we want to change it?
May 11 16:23:59 skippy how much are speradshirt shirts?
May 11 16:24:05 westi from memory for screen printing resale of 8-10 a 
tshirt is a good price
May 11 16:24:06 h3h are colors being considered for the new logo at all?
May 11 16:24:09 skeltoac Semio, not iconic enough.
May 11 16:24:19 photomatt I'm going to see if we can get a sample from them, 
if the quality looks good perhaps we can give them a spot on the forums for 
a month in exchange for a deal on shirts
May 11 16:24:23 westi skippy: 
http://www.spreadshirt.com/Products_and_Printin.17.0.html
May 11 16:24:31 Blackb|rd Pplproof: well, it's hard to both convey free 
(libre) and high-quality
May 11 16:24:39 photomatt h3h: haven't gotten to colors yet, just making it 
work in B/W first
May 11 16:24:45 h3h got it
May 11 16:24:47 carthik photomatt, I hope they do not end up having a 
monopoly though.
May 11 16:24:49 * citizenjim has quit ()
May 11 16:24:58 photomatt carthik: who?
May 11 16:25:01 carthik photomatt, what will be usage restrictions on the 
logo/brand be?
May 11 16:25:05 Firas Is WP going to be trademarked?
May 11 16:25:06 * h3h votes for the one on the top in 4.01
May 11 16:25:07 carthik photomatt, spreadshirt
May 11 16:25:29 Pplproof Blackb|rd: Not neccessarily... There's still a 
difference between high-quality, and "elitist". You can still have something 
that's "sophisticated", etc.
May 11 16:25:36 photomatt "WordPress" is being trademarked, yes
May 11 16:25:47 photomatt it needs to be for protection, as
wordpress.com<http://wordpress.com>showed us
May 11 16:25:49 Firas which might create another problem that firefox is 
dealing with
May 11 16:25:56 Blackb|rd Pplproof: but it gets exceedingly difficult (not 
argueing: it's what we should aim for, but it's hard to do)
May 11 16:25:57 Firas yeah, i agree, it should be
May 11 16:26:03 factoryjoe yeah it's a tough nut to crack
May 11 16:26:12 factoryjoe (licensing that is)
May 11 16:26:16 Pplproof Blackb|rd: I certainly agree... But that's what I 
get paid to do. ;)
May 11 16:26:30 Blackb|rd Pplproof: then do it already! ;))
May 11 16:26:42 Pplproof Blackb|rd: That's why I was asking Matt! ;D
May 11 16:26:43 Pplproof lol
May 11 16:26:45 factoryjoe photomatt: i started a conversation w/ the 
creative commons guys about doing to trademark what they've done for 
copyright
May 11 16:26:53 MCincubus Yeah... if it's not going to even be considered, 
it's not worth his time.
May 11 16:26:54 factoryjoe glenn over there is v. interested
May 11 16:27:04 Firas that's very interesting
May 11 16:27:07 photomatt factoryjoe: that could be interesting
May 11 16:27:10 factoryjoe yes
May 11 16:27:17 Blackb|rd photomatt: I have to second Pplproof in that 
volunteer pros might have a few ideas that this large circle of poeple might 
overlook.
May 11 16:27:17 photomatt the current "stance" is
May 11 16:27:19 factoryjoe me and steven garrity brought it up last fall
May 11 16:27:26 factoryjoe when we first started having problems on SFX
May 11 16:27:40 photomatt don't use "wordpress" in your domain or site name, 
everything else is fair
May 11 16:27:54 factoryjoe that's the problem...
May 11 16:27:57 factoryjoe you can't just say that
May 11 16:28:07 factoryjoe the law doesn't allow you to if you're going to 
"protect it"
May 11 16:28:11 photomatt I know
May 11 16:28:12 Pplproof Identity-related matters are rarely (not to shut 
everyone out, just stating a fact I've dealt with before) something that are 
handled effectively by a committee.
May 11 16:28:12 factoryjoe hence we need an alternative
May 11 16:29:07 Blackb|rd Pplproof: I have the vision that WP might want to 
be to Blogging what LaTeX is to papers/articles in academia.
May 11 16:29:16 factoryjoe in any case, this is real issue to consider 
sooner than later as you move fwd w/ trademark
May 11 16:29:26 factoryjoe roping the CC guys in now would be smart I think
May 11 16:29:29 photomatt I think that's good for this week w/r/t identity, 
let's talk about it again next week though
May 11 16:29:33 factoryjoe I can do intros if you want...
May 11 16:29:46 Blackb|rd photomatt: ack. let's move on.
May 11 16:29:49 factoryjoe just lemme know
May 11 16:30:14 Firas i'm nobody but i'd recommend that photomatt and cc 
hookup in this trademark issue :D
May 11 16:30:22 MCincubus I move that we move to 1.5.1 => 1.5.2 discussion.
May 11 16:30:30 twistedraisin not true, firas, your plugin kicks ass.
May 11 16:30:31 photomatt Firas: I'll follow up on that
May 11 16:30:33 masquerade Firas, that's what factoryjoe was recommending
May 11 16:30:35 photomatt MCincubus: let's save that for last
May 11 16:30:36 skippy I second MCincubus 
May 11 16:30:44 skippy darn
May 11 16:30:48 skippy too slow.
May 11 16:31:02 RandyWalker lol
May 11 16:31:06 Firas ok, want next codex item now?
May 11 16:31:07 photomatt maybe the topic by Lorelle now
May 11 16:31:08 photomatt is she here?
May 11 16:31:15 relle here
May 11 16:31:28 RandyWalker no Lo ?
May 11 16:31:29 RandyWalker :)
May 11 16:31:35 relle Possibility of assigning "positions or areas of 
responsiblity" for coordindation of the various Codex activities and 
assignments.
May 11 16:31:38 photomatt relle: What did you have in mind?
May 11 16:31:40 relle no lo ;-)
May 11 16:31:46 RandyWalker :-D
May 11 16:32:13 photomatt more specifically, what responsibilities do you 
think need assigning
May 11 16:32:16 relle The Codex is really tightening up and I'd like to see 
some responsiblity assigned to volunteers to coordinate efforts.
May 11 16:32:28 relle After the name of the admin, I'd like to see areas of 
responsibility.
May 11 16:32:38 twistedraisin what do you need the volunteers to do?
May 11 16:32:50 relle So if someone comes in and is a plugin expert, I would 
know to send them to X who is in charge of plugin information on the codex.
May 11 16:33:02 relle If someone wants to help with Lessons, they would know 
that this is my baby.
May 11 16:33:05 ryanduff|laptop who let RandyWalker in here :P
May 11 16:33:05 RandyWalker relle: are you saying, like "So and so: you're 
in charge of Templating, Whatshisname is in charge of Installation" etc?
May 11 16:33:13 relle Something like that.
May 11 16:33:16 RandyWalker ryanduff|laptop: I've been in here :P
May 11 16:33:31 relle A lot of people come in and say I want to help, I'm 
good at X and then they are ignored.
May 11 16:33:31 photomatt I don't know if the docs team is big enough for 
that
May 11 16:33:53 relle Why not?
May 11 16:33:56 skippy at a high-level, I think it would work.
May 11 16:34:04 Semiologic relle: i think a better approach would be to 
simply making it more obvious who is maintaining the codex
May 11 16:34:08 relle Already people like macmanx handle themes and plugins 
- so why not say so on the list.
May 11 16:34:20 relle Obvious is good and that is in the works.
May 11 16:34:23 Semiologic and to list where contributors write
May 11 16:34:30 relle BINGO!
May 11 16:34:37 relle They are just a list of names.
May 11 16:34:56 * ColdForged
(~ColdForge at cpe-024-211-175-171.nc.res.rr.com<http://cpe-024-211-175-171.nc.res.rr.com>)
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May 11 16:35:01 photomatt this list? 
http://codex.wordpress.org/Special:Listadmins
May 11 16:35:02 Semiologic if you say so: i wouldn't even know where to find 
the said list in the codex
May 11 16:35:04 photomatt that page isn't editable
May 11 16:35:05 carthik I think the way it works now is fine: we have a few 
SysOps admins, clearly listed, and I just edited the few pages introducing 
the Codex to new volunteers that those are the people to contact in case of 
confusion, as also sending a mail to the wp-docs list.
May 11 16:35:33 relle The new http://codex.wordpress.org/Codex:Tasks Task 
List Carthik and I put together is ready and waiting for people to sign up 
and get involved and I'd like to see people help direct the efforts.
May 11 16:35:40 * Amazon
(~kieran at h-67-100-116-146.snvacaid.covad.net<http://h-67-100-116-146.snvacaid.covad.net>)
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May 11 16:36:19 photomatt I think we have a overuse of the stubs like 
{{Copyedit}}
May 11 16:36:20 relle photomatt: yes, that list or something like it.
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May 11 16:36:32 photomatt if those were more judiciously applied perhaps 
they could be used more to direct efforts
May 11 16:36:37 twistedraisin I don't mind volunteering, I just haven't been 
sure where my effort is needed as of yet.
May 11 16:36:44 ringmaster Well if people would actually *Edit Copy* that 
wouldn't be an issue...
May 11 16:37:00 relle twistedraisin, that's a great example of what I'm 
getting at.
May 11 16:37:05 carthik photomatt, the page you linked to has a template 
that can be edited, to add leading text, before the list itself.
May 11 16:37:23 relle If people know that Lorelle is in charge of Lessons - 
then they could leave a message on my user page and I could direct their 
energies.
May 11 16:37:46 skippy relle: your user page was intimidatingly cluttered 
last time I looked at it.
May 11 16:37:52 relle I'm not talking about corporate bureacracy here, just 
some info.
May 11 16:37:55 skippy I wasn't sure leaving you a message would produce 
meaningful results.
May 11 16:38:07 relle Hit the discussion page to leave a message.
May 11 16:38:07 photomatt maybe if the 
http://codex.wordpress.org/Codex:Contributing page could have a better call 
to action
May 11 16:38:08 Firas i almost just suggested that the codex should have a 
wiki
May 11 16:38:18 RandyWalker Firas: uhhh
May 11 16:38:19 photomatt discussion should probably *mostly* happen over 
the docs list
May 11 16:38:23 westi Firas: but that wiki would need a codex!
May 11 16:38:27 photomatt as following discussion on the wiki is horrid
May 11 16:38:35 relle It puts a big YOU HAVE MESSAGES on the site when I 
visit. Always post messages in the User discussion area.
May 11 16:38:39 carthik photomatt, I am open to improving that page, however 
it's possible.
May 11 16:38:41 masquerade While on the wiki, why not set it as a redirect 
to the codex?
May 11 16:39:03 relle photomatt, the Contributing page has been totally 
redone in the past few days by Carthik and it's MUCH better.
May 11 16:39:05 MCincubus There is some really old 1.2 stuff on wiki that 
could actually be doing harm.
May 11 16:39:16 photomatt on wiki.wordpress.org <http://wiki.wordpress.org>?
May 11 16:39:20 relle Yes.
May 11 16:39:24 * MCincubus nods
May 11 16:39:27 photomatt ideally the relevant articles should redirect to 
the new wiki
May 11 16:39:34 photomatt phpwiki supports external redirects
May 11 16:39:35 carthik photomatt, on the subject of {{Templates}} I made a 
list at http://codex.wordpress.org/Codex:Maintenance which are the ones 
intended for use, and none else. I think the set is optimal for use
May 11 16:39:38 relle Some great stuff that is still in the works to be 
moved to the new Codex, but harmful stuff too.
May 11 16:39:59 skippy relle: I was speaking about your discussion page. 
It's so full that I wasn't sure _my_ discussion would generate any activity, 
and would be lost in the shuffle.
May 11 16:40:16 photomatt relle: perhaps the task for the next few weeks 
could be transitioning the old wiki more finally
May 11 16:40:18 relle Skippy, just add a note to the bottom. I'll look at 
cleaning it up later.
May 11 16:40:23 carthik skippy, relle, I move old discussions into sub pages 
of my Talk page - might help
May 11 16:40:26 relle Sure.
May 11 16:40:28 masquerade I'd recommend setting
wiki.wordpress.org<http://wiki.wordpress.org>to point to the codex,
and have a special subdomain where the docs team
could get to the wiki to transfer new information older
May 11 16:40:48 skippy carthik: good idea. *I* know how it works, but a new 
contributor might feel even more overwhelmed than me.
May 11 16:40:54 photomatt masquerade: there are still lots of links to pages 
there, the pages themselves should redirect, not the whole subdomain
May 11 16:41:56 photomatt relle: would you like to be the person who assigns 
incoming <strike>victims</strike> volunteers to the codex?
May 11 16:42:18 relle Hmmmm.
May 11 16:42:33 relle I'll think about it.
May 11 16:42:49 MCincubus http://codex.wordpress.org/Put_me_in_coach ;-)
May 11 16:43:05 RandyWalker I wanna work on the Codex too
May 11 16:43:11 relle I think that anyone could push someone towards an area 
IF THEY KNEW WHO DID WHAT.
May 11 16:43:25 carthik RandyWalker, did you really that just now? ;)
May 11 16:43:47 Firas relle: start a page on the community area?
May 11 16:43:54 Firas where people can sign up to be topic leaders
May 11 16:43:58 relle RandyWalker: 
http://codex.wordpress.org/Codex:Community_Portal
May 11 16:44:01 Firas who you can get in touch with
May 11 16:44:02 photomatt relle: people can put their interests on their 
forum profile
May 11 16:44:03 carthik relle, but basically, what is the need for such 
specialization, considering the volunteer nature of the effort and all.
May 11 16:44:06 RandyWalker carthik had me working on some stuff a while 
ago. but the codex is kinda overwhelming. I need specifics on wat to do..
May 11 16:44:10 RandyWalker carthik: eh?
May 11 16:44:19 relle Directed effort.
May 11 16:44:35 relle Randy and twistedraisin gave good examples: I want to 
help but I don't know what to do.
May 11 16:44:43 carthik RandyWalker, the Codex:Contributing page defines 
things you can do, almost all the things, in a hopefully simple straight 
fashion
May 11 16:44:44 relle I don't know who to turn to. I don't know where to go. 
Who to ask.
May 11 16:45:02 RandyWalker these pages are hard to find...
May 11 16:45:04 photomatt relle: would the docs list be a good place to 
start?
May 11 16:45:14 relle Sure.
May 11 16:45:21 relle This is what I would do if I were in charge of the 
world.
May 11 16:45:25 carthik relle, consider this, there is no list about which 
dev is responsible for what part of WP's code, for one.
May 11 16:45:32 relle Make a list of the areas covered by who.
May 11 16:45:32 photomatt relle: perhaps with shorter, more direct messages. 
before I've had trouble with the length of what you were writing, personally 
:)
May 11 16:46:01 relle Then if you find someone with an interest, shove them 
towards that person.
May 11 16:46:09 twistedraisin relle: Well I signed up for something minor 
for now
May 11 16:46:11 relle What messages?
May 11 16:46:14 carthik ...who might be busy, relle :)
May 11 16:46:16 relle Thanks. Great.
May 11 16:46:38 photomatt well I think an interests page would be a good 
idea
May 11 16:46:41 Semiologic Lorelle: why can't this be a heat map?
May 11 16:46:49 relle What be a heat map?
May 11 16:46:54 photomatt lik relle suggested, let people put their name and 
their expertise
May 11 16:47:03 factoryjoe sounds like 43things
May 11 16:47:05 photomatt and then anyone can route. is that the idea?
May 11 16:47:09 photomatt factoryjoe: damn hippie
May 11 16:47:10 Semiologic for instance, you could use the existing 
'categories' as tags, and draw a heat map of where contributors write
May 11 16:47:13 relle YES!
May 11 16:47:13 factoryjoe haha
May 11 16:47:32 relle Heat map = clutter.
May 11 16:47:35 Firas you'd need to keep track of that though
May 11 16:47:41 carthik oh please don't talking about mediawiki hacking, now 
:)
May 11 16:47:43 Firas mediawiki is not something that can be easily hacked 
into is it
May 11 16:47:48 Semiologic the only thing that would be required would be to 
tag pages some bit
May 11 16:47:50 Firas carthik: jinx :)
May 11 16:47:56 factoryjoe 
http://flickr.com/photos/factoryjoe/11118526/in/set-272946/
May 11 16:48:08 Semiologic speaking of mediawiki -- why isn't the codex 
running wordpress? :)
May 11 16:48:18 relle OKay, so carthik and I will work on a list asking 
people to list their interest and involvement in the Codex for others to 
seek out.
May 11 16:48:28 Firas 'coz WP isn't the best tool for a wiki?
May 11 16:48:31 masquerade Quick suggestion: anyone care to extend the 
meeting, as there are quite a few more topics that I doubt can be covered in 
10 minutes
May 11 16:48:32 carthik Semiologic, WordPress is not a collaborative editing 
tool.
May 11 16:48:43 jonabad i second masquerade
May 11 16:48:51 twistedraisin Semiologic: wordpress is a blogging, not wiki, 
tool
May 11 16:49:02 carthik relle, we both can't - each person will have to 
speak for themselves, pretty much.
May 11 16:49:36 relle "I" will work on a list that will INVITE people to 
sign up with their interst and involvement in the Codex.
May 11 16:49:37 Firas if we need to keep time deadlines then we need a 
secretary-type or something to move us along (even photomatt), if not the 
meeting should just keep going until it exhausts...
May 11 16:50:08 relle That should help direct people to who does what and to 
find out how to help.
May 11 16:50:10 Semiologic carthik: i find it amazingly rich so far, as a 
cms. wiki is just a few steps away
May 11 16:50:11 * Falo
(~SMILE at 84-72-89-182.dclient.hispeed.ch<http://84-72-89-182.dclient.hispeed.ch>)
has joined #wordpress-meetup
May 11 16:50:24 Pplproof I used to take parlimentary procedure in high 
school and college, but I refuse.
May 11 16:50:25 Pplproof ;P
May 11 16:50:26 Pplproof lol
May 11 16:50:29 masquerade I agree with Firas, and I know that it was 
previously mentioned to be ending at 5, which is hardly long enough 
apparently
May 11 16:50:34 carthik Semiologic, evolve till you check mail (old joke, I 
know) :)
May 11 16:50:43 relle I'm done.
May 11 16:50:58 photomatt masquerade: I think we could add 30 minutes and 
cover everything
May 11 16:51:02 twistedraisin thanks for your input, relle.
May 11 16:51:06 * RandyWalker knows parli-pro.
May 11 16:51:22 relle NEXT?
May 11 16:51:31 * mdawaffe (~mdawaffe@
66-215-80-17.pas-dcbi.charterpipeline.net<http://66-215-80-17.pas-dcbi.charterpipeline.net>)
has joined #wordpress-meetup
May 11 16:51:38 photomatt relle: alright, send a link to that page to 
wp-docs when it's up :)
May 11 16:51:42 carthik 'ola mdawaffe 
May 11 16:51:45 relle I will, don't worry.
May 11 16:51:50 mdawaffe hey carthik 
May 11 16:51:53 * skippy has quit ("Free as in Puppies!")
May 11 16:52:00 Firas Timeline for an RSS Patch/1.5.2 (jonabad)
May 11 16:52:51 twistedraisin Ryan was nailing down patch stuff for RSS 
today, I think. Matt had mentioned a few other things worth taking care of 
before the next dot release went out
May 11 16:52:53 photomatt the plan is to get the confirmed patches in the 
source ASAP
May 11 16:52:54 MCincubus Also, Any other things that should be fit into 
1.5.2 release? --MCincubus
May 11 16:53:01 photomatt MCincubus: I'd say no
May 11 16:53:29 photomatt I think getting the fixes out sooner is more 
important
May 11 16:53:54 mikelittle What about the SQL errors here? 
http://mosquito.wordpress.org/view.php?id=1331 
May 11 16:53:59 * westi agrees getting out a bug fix only release soon is 
important
May 11 16:54:06 jonabad photomatt, superfast like this weekend?
May 11 16:54:07 MCincubus What's the deal with the Ping-O-Matic problems 
people have been complaining about?
May 11 16:54:10 photomatt mikelittle: that's fine
May 11 16:54:47 MCincubus Unable to ping Ping-o-Matic 
http://mosquito.wordpress.org/view.php?id=1325
May 11 16:54:58 photomatt MCincubus: I believe it has to do with extended 
pings
May 11 16:55:31 MCincubus worth fixing or not?
May 11 16:55:43 MCincubus for 1.5.2, I mean.
May 11 16:55:45 photomatt MCincubus: already fixed
May 11 16:55:53 photomatt it was a prob in PoM, not WP
May 11 16:56:15 MCincubus Oh cool... then that bug can be closed.
May 11 16:56:39 photomatt done
May 11 16:56:49 twistedraisin 1324,1325,1331, 1323, how about the paging 
bug, we can nail that one into 1.5.2 right?
May 11 16:56:50 mikelittle Matt has wordpress.org
<http://wordpress.org>just died? Getting access refused
May 11 16:56:50 MCincubus RSS stuff is just a rollback?
May 11 16:57:01 photomatt no, the problem was the rollback
May 11 16:57:03 twistedraisin ryan schlogged that one down today I think.
May 11 16:57:05 relle mikelittle: no.
May 11 16:57:10 photomatt it's a change in the rolled-back logic
May 11 16:57:10 relle I'm on it and it's fine.
May 11 16:57:11 * ringmaster|home (~ringmaste@
pool-68-238-242-50.phlapa.fios.verizon.net<http://pool-68-238-242-50.phlapa.fios.verizon.net>)
has joined #wordpress-meetup
May 11 16:57:20 masquerade anyone know if skippy submitted the bug report on 
plugin hooks and posting?
May 11 16:57:22 photomatt have no problem getting to
wordpress.org<http://wordpress.org>here
May 11 16:57:25 MCincubus masquerade, he did
May 11 16:57:34 * masquerade thinks that should be fixed in 1.5.2
May 11 16:57:49 twistedraisin gotta catch a train, later.
May 11 16:57:49 ryanduff|laptop mikelittle: no peoblems here
May 11 16:57:54 * twistedraisin is now known as Provos|T
May 11 16:57:59 MCincubus Would be nice... especially since it enables 
Skippy's plugin to do future-dated pings!
May 11 16:58:02 photomatt okay people chill
May 11 16:58:03 ryanduff|laptop ringmaster|home: welcome
May 11 16:58:14 photomatt there aren't two bugs that will be fixed
May 11 16:58:29 ringmaster|home Hello ryan! Hello again, work self!
May 11 16:58:35 mikelittle my bad. firewall/web cache died!
May 11 16:58:39 photomatt if it's in the bug tracker and isn't a feature, 
and can be fixed soon, then it should work in 1.5.2
May 11 16:59:22 photomatt mostly we need testing and more reporting
May 11 16:59:52 ringmaster|home I think a major part of the problem with the 
1.5.1 release is that there weren't enough testers.
May 11 16:59:54 photomatt the one thing I'm not sure about is the reported 
pingback/trackback problems by people like macmanx
May 11 17:00:07 photomatt ringmaster: I don't think there's enough variety 
of testers
May 11 17:00:15 ringmaster|home On this, I also agree.
May 11 17:00:23 photomatt the pb/tb problem is so sporadic I have no idea 
what it could be, could be his host
May 11 17:00:24 * h3h recommends 
http://mosquito.wordpress.org/view.php?id=1306 for 1.5.2 (simple fix)
May 11 17:00:37 photomatt ringmaster: I saw you did a pb/tb tester, any 
results from that?
May 11 17:00:52 RandyWalker ok, I'm going to shit, shower, and shave :)
May 11 17:00:56 RandyWalker this was fun
May 11 17:01:02 RandyWalker ta ta :)
May 11 17:01:05 ringmaster|home Well, I didn't try it on his site, but I 
tried pingin his site from mine today, and it didn't work.
May 11 17:01:16 RandyWalker (you can remove that from the transcripts if you 
want)
May 11 17:01:19 * RandyWalker (~randy at 207.72.44.28 <http://207.72.44.28>) 
has left #wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:01:30 MCincubus could it be that he doesn't have URL fopen or 
CURL?
May 11 17:01:34 photomatt I think macmanx just has a funky host or 
something, if we can identify anything broader that would help
May 11 17:01:44 photomatt he's on BlueHost, which was recently removed from 
the hosting page
May 11 17:01:59 photomatt MCincubus: no because I was able to send him a 
pingback yesterday
May 11 17:02:46 ringmaster|home Maybe a firewall issue? Or perhaps the 
script times out? Any number of crazy things could be the culprit.
May 11 17:03:29 skeltoac CURL is often thwarted by the host's proxy. GoDaddy 
had one and their tech support couldn't help me get through it.
May 11 17:03:54 skeltoac In the end I upgraded my account just to enable 
fsockopen.
May 11 17:03:59 photomatt people on godaddy hosting are almost hopeless
May 11 17:04:39 skeltoac I'm on a month-to-month basis with them until I can 
afford better.
May 11 17:04:46 michel_v perhaps we could have some way to make pingback not 
check for accuracy and excerpt
May 11 17:04:55 michel_v and instead place the pingback in moderation queue
May 11 17:05:11 MCincubus hm... so... fopen, CURL, moderation?
May 11 17:05:13 photomatt michel_v: they go in moderation queues anyway, and 
I would rather not open it up to spam like trackback
May 11 17:06:07 ringmaster|home Much of the problem is that these features 
are too transparent to debug. Most of it takes place after post.php kicks 
the user back out to the editing page.
May 11 17:06:41 photomatt which is on purpose, because they can be slow
May 11 17:06:57 ringmaster|home Yes. Although a constant that turns that off 
would be *superb*.
May 11 17:07:00 photomatt ideally we could do them in an iframe or similar 
after reload and show status
May 11 17:07:36 westi photomatt: iframe... nah you want AJAX ;)
May 11 17:07:53 ryanduff|laptop westi: I was just about to say that
May 11 17:08:05 photomatt all the same. google maps uses iframes to 
communicate with the server
May 11 17:08:35 Firas is JS a requirement to successfully admin? (i don't 
care either way, just checking)
May 11 17:08:43 photomatt okay, how about internationalized support now?
May 11 17:08:45 photomatt Firas: nope
May 11 17:08:50 ringmaster|home Something that shows the status of the 
pings/trackback after the page reloads would be very user-friendly.
May 11 17:09:00 westi you can do some cool stuff with auto refreshing 
IFRAMEs and some simple JS
May 11 17:09:15 h3h photomatt: note that iframes add an item to the user's 
history, so pressing the Back button would bring about a seemingly undesired 
result. food for though.
May 11 17:09:18 h3h thought.
May 11 17:09:36 westi h3h: do they.. i've not seen that
May 11 17:09:40 photomatt h3h: the point was how it's implemented isn't 
important, just the idea
May 11 17:09:54 h3h i know :) just ensuring clarity going in.
May 11 17:09:54 photomatt neuro`: did you want to say something about 
internationalization?
May 11 17:10:36 ringmaster|home What's the bid deal with i18n, then?
May 11 17:10:51 ringmaster|home s/bid/big
May 11 17:10:59 h3h westi: aye. see [ 
http://beta.xkr.us/js-iframe-location.html ]. click on any link in the 
frame, then click your back button.
May 11 17:12:02 Firas is neuro` there?
May 11 17:12:06 westi h3h: i would say that is correct behaviour
May 11 17:12:11 Firas or we can just move it to next meeting
May 11 17:12:21 photomatt ringmaster: not sure what neuro` wanted to bring 
up, let's put it off for now
May 11 17:12:32 ringmaster|home Ok. :)
May 11 17:12:41 h3h westi: agreed. the point was to beware of that behavior 
if one is to use a hidden iframe to accomplish a task such as monitoring 
[ping|track]backs.
May 11 17:12:54 photomatt eventually there will be i18n version of the 
wordpress.org <http://wordpress.org> website itself on subdomains, but that 
project needs some work
May 11 17:13:39 carthik so what's next?
May 11 17:13:40 Firas Conclude the professional support discussion started 
earlier (Carthik)
May 11 17:13:48 photomatt need some sort of content management system that 
can have a set structure and show english/translation side-by-side for the 
translators
May 11 17:14:13 carthik oh, d'oh, Firas...
May 11 17:14:20 Firas i'm making something like rosetta so if there's 
anything specific i can put into matt let me know
May 11 17:14:27 Firas http://firasd.org/inflexion/
May 11 17:15:06 masquerade or me
May 11 17:15:06 photomatt Firas: sounds like a good idea
May 11 17:15:15 Firas or masquerade
May 11 17:15:25 Firas ok, carthik
May 11 17:15:27 Firas it's your floor
May 11 17:16:18 photomatt professional support?
May 11 17:16:20 carthik maybe Matt wants to push that to the next meetup?
May 11 17:16:29 carthik too late... sorry :)
May 11 17:16:39 photomatt we've got a few minutes
May 11 17:16:54 photomatt carthik: what did you think was a good pickup 
point?
May 11 17:17:08 * ryanduff|laptop has quit ()
May 11 17:17:25 carthik The last time we stopped with the pros and cons of 
"acknowledging" or vouching for professionals who support WP
May 11 17:17:34 carthik and using the wp-pro list to fill this need
May 11 17:17:56 photomatt alright
May 11 17:18:06 photomatt I think OS projects have a natural reputation 
system
May 11 17:18:13 carthik I'd say we think about using the wp foundation to 
drive an effort where everyone can pitch in for the benefit of the 
foundation, and themselves.
May 11 17:18:18 * Blackb|rd (klausman at eric.schwarzvogel.de) has left 
#wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:18:49 carthik I'd think a WP directed professional support system 
is better than "just letting it happen"
May 11 17:19:13 carthik and organized, planned setup is more likely to 
succeed.
May 11 17:19:19 Semiologic you could set up a bounty system :)
May 11 17:19:24 photomatt well at some point I could envision there being 
full time WP employees
May 11 17:19:35 chuyskywalker Semiologic: like google answers...
May 11 17:19:50 Semiologic 
http://www.semiologic.com/open-source-business-model/
May 11 17:19:52 Semiologic like the above link, actually
May 11 17:20:08 Pplproof May I interject something here...?
May 11 17:20:09 photomatt Semiologic: yes, read that
May 11 17:20:10 Semiologic i'm sure plenty of indians will flock to do 
support
May 11 17:20:14 photomatt Pplproof: sure
May 11 17:20:21 carthik photomatt, till we get there, we could have a 
forum/place where people can submit requests for jobs, which can be assigned 
to bounty hunters, who will be rated for the way they completed assigned 
work.
May 11 17:20:29 Firas Semiologic: wtf
May 11 17:20:29 carthik moderated by a few
May 11 17:21:07 Pplproof A number of members of the WP community have been 
discussing that very idea lately, actually...
May 11 17:21:40 Semiologic Firas: want paid support in the forums, or not? 
if you want some, a bounty system could work. e.g. paypal $1 for whever 
fixes this. a US citizen won't care. an indian might care.
May 11 17:22:05 Firas semiologic: ok, ok, that statement just rubbed me 
wrong, sorry
May 11 17:22:07 carthik Semiologic, why specifically Indians, though, I 
wonder :)
May 11 17:22:11 * Firas is indian
May 11 17:22:30 Pplproof We've been working on developing an open source 
business model that's a seperate entity entirely, yet still linked to 
WordPress, offering professional-quality themes as well as paid support.
May 11 17:22:31 MCincubus India is a great place to outsource tech work... 
that's all.
May 11 17:22:31 carthik nevermind, so what are your thoughts, Matt?
May 11 17:22:44 * westi looks at the clock and realises them time
May 11 17:22:48 westi night all
May 11 17:22:54 * westi is now known as westi|gone
May 11 17:22:54 carthik nite, westi
May 11 17:22:59 Semiologic carthik: my experience is that ukrainians and 
russians program better (i work a lot with both). but idians are cool too, 
and speak better english :)
May 11 17:23:17 photomatt there has been some question about whether plugins 
and/or themes can be non-GPL if distributed
May 11 17:23:33 Firas photomatt: hmm
May 11 17:23:37 MCincubus Is there a definitive answer?
May 11 17:23:39 Pplproof photomatt: Of particular importance to you, 10% of 
all money we bring in will be donated directly to WordPress development.
May 11 17:24:27 carthik photomatt, I figure there is nothing stopping them 
from being non-GPL legally.
May 11 17:24:38 photomatt MCincubus: I think a good argument could be made 
for them being virally GPL
May 11 17:24:46 photomatt since they link lots of internal WP GPL code
May 11 17:24:50 Pplproof photomatt: We've got a solution to that too.
May 11 17:24:54 Pplproof :D
May 11 17:24:58 MCincubus or sometimes take it, modify it, and stick it in.
May 11 17:25:01 photomatt Pplproof: who's "we"?
May 11 17:25:07 * Firas is in this thing with pplproof and masquerade and a 
few others, so is very interested
May 11 17:25:22 Firas pplproof: he means a legal issue at release time
May 11 17:25:39 carthik ( Semiologic, that's interesting to learn :) )
May 11 17:26:03 * Jason__
(~TheJason at 12-217-255-187.client.mchsi.com<http://12-217-255-187.client.mchsi.com>)
has joined #wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:26:07 photomatt I personally don't mind people developing paid 
themes/plugins
May 11 17:26:14 photomatt I think it could be a healthy ecosystem
May 11 17:26:15 Pplproof photomatt: Firas, Jenn, Robert (Masquerade), etc...
May 11 17:26:45 ringmaster|home But the result should be GPL-licensed, even 
if the initial work is paid.
May 11 17:26:54 Pplproof Instead of having seperate resources however, 
bringing them under one umbrella.
May 11 17:26:59 Pplproof No doubt.
May 11 17:27:01 Semiologic matt: based on the market study I conducted from 
my site, I think there's plenty room for hosted wordpress as well
May 11 17:27:04 photomatt ringmaster: that's been everything I've done
May 11 17:27:14 photomatt Semiologic: hosted WP is definitely a direction 
we're headed in
May 11 17:27:26 Firas photomatt, is there anyone you can talk to about 
whether they can be (c) or not? to kinda help a demarcated line for people 
thinking of business models around WP
May 11 17:27:31 carthik ringmaster, but there is ne legal requirement that 
states that, I should think.
May 11 17:27:47 Semiologic send me a notice if you do -- I'm seriously 
considering a wp business
May 11 17:27:53 MCincubus you can modify it for private use and not have to 
share anything.
May 11 17:28:01 photomatt Firas: I'm not a lawyer, and I don't really know 
any
May 11 17:28:06 Firas ok
May 11 17:28:10 photomatt it probably wouldn't hurt sending a note to the 
FSF
May 11 17:28:19 relle photomatt: Get to know some lawyers VERY FAST.
May 11 17:28:34 Firas i'll find out
May 11 17:29:14 photomatt alright, might be worth reporting back next week
May 11 17:29:19 carthik There was a discussion on Alex King's site once 
about a Mambo Module, GPL and such, might be of interest, Firas.
May 11 17:29:27 relle There are volunteer legal organizations dedicated to 
helping "artists" and WordPress might slip in to that realm. They are 
experts in copyright, trademark, protection, and so on. Right up WP's alley.
May 11 17:29:38 relle I'll email you a list next week.
May 11 17:29:44 Pplproof relle: I've been looking into that actually. :)
May 11 17:29:51 relle Then you send him the list.
May 11 17:29:55 carthik photomatt, but what about prof. support, any 
thoughts, to conclude?
May 11 17:31:05 photomatt carthik: I think it's something to continue to 
pursue, maybe a good first step would to get a list of people who would like 
to do professional support
May 11 17:31:18 MCincubus Codex?
May 11 17:31:22 photomatt and start a discussion amoung that group as to 
rates, donations, etc
May 11 17:31:40 carthik photomatt, maybe a mail (from you) on hackers?
May 11 17:31:59 carthik a page at the codex, if necessary to keep track.
May 11 17:32:40 Semiologic projects don't survive on donations. you need a 
more regular stream of cash than that.
May 11 17:32:57 Firas make wp-pro more obvious
May 11 17:33:11 Firas basically, i've seen many people come into irc and 
ask, where can i get professionals for wp?
May 11 17:33:20 carthik Firas, that was one of the options consider 
(inconclusively) the last time.
May 11 17:33:22 relle On the forum constantly.
May 11 17:33:22 Firas anything to help the two groups conect would be great
May 11 17:33:23 MCincubus Yeah... I'm sure that in exchange for a nice 
open-market for WP work, hosted on a wp.org <http://wp.org> site, devs would 
be willing to promise a cut go back to WP
May 11 17:33:25 Semiologic there's a wp-pro list?
May 11 17:33:38 Pplproof Exactly my point.
May 11 17:33:38 Pplproof :/
May 11 17:33:51 carthik Yeah, for now, perhaps, you could point the souls at 
wp-pro?
May 11 17:34:12 carthik but that may "stick" too hard :)
May 11 17:34:40 Firas So, what's the resoultion
May 11 17:34:43 photomatt carthik: I'll send a message out to hackers
May 11 17:34:45 chuyskywalker And I can imagine resistance to joining an 
emai llist to get the help
May 11 17:34:48 MCincubus http://codex.wordpress.org/Mailing_Lists
May 11 17:34:51 Firas how are we going to connect freelancers + people 
looking for work
May 11 17:34:53 * Provos|T is now known as twistedraisin
May 11 17:35:05 Firas photomatt: maybe to wp.org/dev <http://wp.org/dev>blog?
May 11 17:35:16 carthik photomatt, Firas, so that will be the temporary 
resolution - and exploration of what it might entail by mailing wp-hackers.
May 11 17:35:30 MCincubus Best solution: forum specialized for this use.
May 11 17:35:35 carthik s/and/an
May 11 17:36:13 photomatt professional support is much more significant in 
the enterprise space
May 11 17:36:37 Firas good point
May 11 17:36:39 carthik right, and for that you need some staff and 
employees.
May 11 17:36:52 michel_v it's also more time and resources consuming
May 11 17:36:53 Firas MCIncubus' idea is good
May 11 17:37:02 Firas make a forum or a section on the wp forums
May 11 17:37:10 relle I'm for that.
May 11 17:37:20 photomatt the last thing we need is more clutter on the 
forums
May 11 17:37:26 relle Or a reference list on the Codex, then.
May 11 17:37:31 MCincubus New forum, I'd say.
May 11 17:37:39 carthik While on forums, I was, and am a part of 
http://blogbarter.com - which is just such a forum - not too popular though 
with WP users as with MT users...
May 11 17:38:07 * geeksmakemehot (~Jenn@
ppp-70-249-61-93.dsl.ltrkar.swbell.net<http://ppp-70-249-61-93.dsl.ltrkar.swbell.net>)
has joined #wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:38:14 carthik photomatt, I suggest we conclude the discussion on 
support for now, and move on to the next - time's running out fast :)
May 11 17:38:15 photomatt I that wraps it up for today
May 11 17:38:21 photomatt I'm not feeling well, so going to head home
May 11 17:38:42 photomatt same time, same place, next week :)
May 11 17:38:54 Pplproof Of course. :)
May 11 17:38:58 relle Thank you.
May 11 17:39:08 roo_ Thanks all, ive enjoyed reading.
May 11 17:39:21 * mikelittle (~mike@
spc1-stkp2-4-0-cust182.bagu.broadband.ntl.com<http://spc1-stkp2-4-0-cust182.bagu.broadband.ntl.com>)
has left #wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:39:23 MCincubus </meetup> (for whomever is logging)
May 11 17:39:28 mdawaffe Talk to you later carthik, Podz gotta run
May 11 17:39:36 carthik mdawaffe, later!
May 11 17:39:36 * geeksmakemehot (~Jenn@
ppp-70-249-61-93.dsl.ltrkar.swbell.net<http://ppp-70-249-61-93.dsl.ltrkar.swbell.net>)
has left #wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:39:54 * chuyskywalker
(~chuy at 64-142-94-171.dsl.static.sonic.net<http://64-142-94-171.dsl.static.sonic.net>)
has left #wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:40:10 carthik I'm not gonna attempt transcribing the meetup this 
time.
May 11 17:40:22 MCincubus heh, that was crazy.
May 11 17:40:23 jonabad carthik, i'll do it
May 11 17:40:30 carthik jonabad, cool, dude!
May 11 17:40:41 * mdawaffe has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by 
peer))
May 11 17:40:47 carthik jonabad, please use a subpage, etc ... :)
May 11 17:40:52 michel_v what time is it in the reference timezone?
May 11 17:41:04 michel_v just for checks, since I just arrived and it's 
already over :p
May 11 17:41:18 carthik michel_v, it's 5 PM EST.
May 11 17:41:24 Firas ok, anyone who was interested in what pplproof was 
talkig about
May 11 17:41:25 michel_v I mean right now
May 11 17:41:28 carthik michel_v, it's been on for 1:30 now
May 11 17:41:32 Firas #tempthingie
May 11 17:41:33 michel_v "EST" is alien to me
May 11 17:41:35 michel_v alright
May 11 17:41:45 * factoryjoe
(~cmessina at h-67-100-116-146.snvacaid.covad.net<http://h-67-100-116-146.snvacaid.covad.net>)
has left #wordpress-meetup
May 11 17:41:48 carthik michel_v, it is 6:30 PM in New York now
May 11 17:42:09 MCincubus GMT -05
May 11 17:42:15 MCincubus er, -04
May 11 17:42:20 MCincubus damn DST
May 11 17:42:25 carthik It started at 5:00 PM, New york, so to speak.
May 11 17:42:25 * jonabad has quit ("Trillian (
http://www.ceruleanstudios.com")
May 11 17:42:39 michel_v ok
May 11 17:42:46 * photomatt has quit ()
May 11 17:43:00 michel_v so I'll know to be there by 23:00 gtm+2 next 
wednesday
May 11 17:43:03 michel_v gmt, even
May 11 17:45:10 carthik michel_v, right, 21:00 GMT. I will make a note of it 
on the Codex, too.
May 11 17:45:38 michel_v yup
May 11 17:45:47 michel_v it would be clearer for non-US folks
May 11 17:45:59 michel_v I'm sick of seeing EST, MST, w
May 11 17:46:04 michel_v whateverST, then PST :p
May 11 17:46:06 carthik edited
May 11 17:46:15 michel_v thanks :)


On 5/11/05, Matt Mullenweg <m at mullenweg.com> wrote:
> 
> See you all on Freenode in #wordpress-meetup in a few minutes.
> 
> --
> Matt Mullenweg
> http://photomatt.net | http://wordpress.org
> http://pingomatic.com | http://cnet.com
> _______________________________________________
> wp-hackers mailing list
> wp-hackers at lists.automattic.com
> http://lists.automattic.com/mailman/listinfo/wp-hackers
> 



-- 
--Robert Deaton
http://somethingunpredictable.com
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