It is kinda funny that the UI Group communicates through a mailing list chain. Why not a proper forum?<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 7:12 PM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:wp-ui-request@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui-request@lists.automattic.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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<br>Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: Admin theme-ing (Michael Kuhlmann)<br>
2. Re: Admin theme-ing (andr? renaut)<br>
3. Re: Admin theme-ing (Jane Wells)<br>
4. Re: wp-ui Digest, Vol 6, Issue 6 (andr? renaut)<br>
5. Re: Admin theme-ing (andr? renaut)<br>
6. Re: Admin theme-ing (Jeremy Clarke)<br>
7. Re: Admin theme-ing (John O'Nolan)<br>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Michael Kuhlmann <<a href="mailto:sactown.mike@gmail.com">sactown.mike@gmail.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:wp-ui@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2010 16:05:31 -0700<br>Subject: Re: [wp-ui] Admin theme-ing<br>
<div bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
The obvious "benefit" of being able to theme the admin area is to carry
over the branding from the front-end to the back-end. John already
mentioned two good ways of cleaning it up and this plugin
<a href="http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/white-label-cms/" target="_blank">http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/white-label-cms/</a> would certainly
take care of the rest. I don't think the option to theme the admin area
is the best one either, even though I *love* to theme virtually
anything I can get my hands on -- some things are better left alone to
retain simplicity.<br>
<br>
Here's just one scenario of how this could go south very quickly: A
designer decides to fully rebrand, redesign the backend and revert to a
horizontal menu a la WP 2.0, at her client's request. She decides to
bail the site/maintenance after a year or two and the menu is all out
of whack, come the next upgrade. Now, the client has a funky menu and
it's all WordPress' fault. The client could just get rid of the custom
admin theme altogether, but that would mean having to re-learn to the
navigation. Again, it's all WordPress' fault. Well, not really... but
you get what I mean. This is typically how a CMS gets pounded on.<br>
<br>
Mike<br>
<br>
On 6/3/2010 3:08 PM, Toon Van de Putte wrote:
<blockquote type="cite">Is all of this well documented? The Screen Options I know
about, but the custom fields thing is new to me. But my main argument
was <i>against</i> admin themes. I don't see the point, frankly,
besides some superficial cosmetic stuff.<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 11:54 PM, John
O'Nolan <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:john.wp@onolan.org" target="_blank">john.wp@onolan.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">Hi Toon,
<div>You can already hide many panels via the Screen Options tab,
and custom fields are fairly easy to customise now via the
functions.php file of a theme, no need for a plugin!</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Hope that helps</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<font color="#888888">
<div>John</div>
</font>
<div>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On 3 Jun 2010, at 22:36, Toon Van de Putte wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">I don't think that is a good idea. I think
it's one of those features that sets Wordpress apart from, say, Drupal
and that makes Wordpress much more usable out-of-the-box.<br>
The standardized look 'n' feel of the admin is one of the reasons I
really like Wordpress. It just works, and it makes sense that a
well-designed admin interface doesn't need themes.<br>
What I would like is the ability to show/hide certain panels, have more
flexibility in how custom fields are integrated (without resorting to a
plugin), etc. But the basic layout and functionality of the admin does
not need theming, imho.<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 11:02 PM, Luke
Gedeon <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:luke.gedeon@gmail.com" target="_blank">luke.gedeon@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
Call me crazy, but it seems like the easiest way to solve the look and
feel issues with the admin is to make it as easy to theme the admin as
it is to theme the site.<br>
<br>
Give designers a while and see what ideas happen. We can then take the
best ideas and build them into the default theme.<br>
<br>
To encourage theme development we need to:<br>
1. Set-up an admin theme repository.<br>
2. Add a page inside admin to choose and install new admin themes.<br>
3. Make admin themes editable in theme editor tool.<br>
4. Allow users to select admin themes separate from site themes but
allow theme designers to ship matching/complementary themes.<br>
<br>
I have got to be missing something????<br>
<br clear="all">
-------------------------------------------<br>
<font color="#888888">Luke Gedeon<br>
<a href="http://luke.gedeon.name" target="_blank">http://luke.gedeon.name</a><br>
</font><br>
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<pre><fieldset></fieldset>
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</blockquote>
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</div>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: "andré renaut" <<a href="mailto:andre.renaut@gmail.com">andre.renaut@gmail.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:wp-ui@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 01:12:27 +0200<br>Subject: Re: [wp-ui] Admin theme-ing<br>Theming admin !!!???<br><br>under admin, plugins pages stick and rely on the UI admin (html &css).<br><br>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Jane Wells <<a href="mailto:jane@automattic.com">jane@automattic.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:wp-ui@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2010 16:13:58 -0700<br>Subject: Re: [wp-ui] Admin theme-ing<br>Admin theming remains plugin territory for the time being.<br>
Jane<br>
<br>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: "andré renaut" <<a href="mailto:andre.renaut@gmail.com">andre.renaut@gmail.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:wp-ui@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 01:16:22 +0200<br>Subject: Re: [wp-ui] wp-ui Digest, Vol 6, Issue 6<br>@John<br><br>i think Toon is speaking about Roles and Capabilities.<br>As wp-cron, those tools exist in core but cannot be administrated thru core admin.<br>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: "andré renaut" <<a href="mailto:andre.renaut@gmail.com">andre.renaut@gmail.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:wp-ui@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 01:17:31 +0200<br>Subject: Re: [wp-ui] Admin theme-ing<br>@John<br><br>i think Toon is speaking about Roles and Capabilities.<br>As
wp-cron, those tools exist in core but cannot be administrated thru
core admin.
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: Jeremy Clarke <<a href="mailto:jer@simianuprising.com">jer@simianuprising.com</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:wp-ui@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2010 19:33:02 -0400<br>Subject: Re: [wp-ui] Admin theme-ing<br>On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 5:36 PM, Toon Van de Putte <<a href="mailto:toon@automaton.be">toon@automaton.be</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
> I don't think that is a good idea. I think it's one of those features that sets Wordpress apart from, say, Drupal and that makes Wordpress much more usable out-of-the-box.<br>
<br>
I think this is a very salient point. Drupals integration between<br>
front and backend was one of the biggest UI disasters it had to suffer<br>
through. In recent versions they have moved away from that model and<br>
towards standardized backend designs, to the great benefit of their<br>
users.<br>
<br>
<br>
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 5:18 PM, John O'Nolan <<a href="mailto:john.wp@onolan.org">john.wp@onolan.org</a>> wrote:<br>
> contributions once we start to spec out the 3.1 features in the UI Group.<br>
<br>
Isn't this the ui *group*?<br>
<br>
Your link is to the UI blog, a terrible place to have discussions. Yes<br>
there are comments but there is no way to be notified of new comments<br>
or replies by email. For the authors of posts it works fine, you must<br>
get emails when people comment, but there is no way to make sure that<br>
people above your know you replied to them, or that you have a chance<br>
to reply to people who make comments on your comments.<br>
<br>
I think if we want to have discussions this is the appropriate place,<br>
and any decision that is 'discussed' on the blog that is of any<br>
importance should be discussed here as well.<br>
<br>
Obviously I'd support subscribe-to-comments or Intense Debate being<br>
installed on the blog as well.<br>
<br>
--<br>
Jeremy Clarke<br>
Code and Design | <a href="http://globalvoicesonline.org" target="_blank">globalvoicesonline.org</a><br>
<br>
<br><br>---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: John O'Nolan <<a href="mailto:john.wp@onolan.org">john.wp@onolan.org</a>><br>To: <a href="mailto:jer@simianuprising.com">jer@simianuprising.com</a>, <a href="mailto:wp-ui@lists.automattic.com">wp-ui@lists.automattic.com</a><br>
Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2010 01:12:02 +0100<br>Subject: Re: [wp-ui] Admin theme-ing<br>The UI Group lives on on the UI Blog, yes it has some limitations - but those are being worked on. We've discussed comment notifications and that's absolutely something we'd like to have soon.<br>
<br>
As of right now, the best place for discussion (as is the case with the core developers) is during the weekly meetings, details of which can be found on the UI Blog, which is why I linked to it.<br>
<br>
John<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 4 Jun 2010, at 00:33, Jeremy Clarke wrote:<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 5:36 PM, Toon Van de Putte <<a href="mailto:toon@automaton.be" target="_blank">toon@automaton.be</a>> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
<br>
I don't think that is a good idea. I think it's one of those features that sets Wordpress apart from, say, Drupal and that makes Wordpress much more usable out-of-the-box.<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
I think this is a very salient point. Drupals integration between<br>
front and backend was one of the biggest UI disasters it had to suffer<br>
through. In recent versions they have moved away from that model and<br>
towards standardized backend designs, to the great benefit of their<br>
users.<br>
<br>
<br>
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 5:18 PM, John O'Nolan <<a href="mailto:john.wp@onolan.org" target="_blank">john.wp@onolan.org</a>> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">
contributions once we start to spec out the 3.1 features in the UI Group.<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
Isn't this the ui *group*?<br>
<br>
Your link is to the UI blog, a terrible place to have discussions. Yes<br>
there are comments but there is no way to be notified of new comments<br>
or replies by email. For the authors of posts it works fine, you must<br>
get emails when people comment, but there is no way to make sure that<br>
people above your know you replied to them, or that you have a chance<br>
to reply to people who make comments on your comments.<br>
<br>
I think if we want to have discussions this is the appropriate place,<br>
and any decision that is 'discussed' on the blog that is of any<br>
importance should be discussed here as well.<br>
<br>
Obviously I'd support subscribe-to-comments or Intense Debate being<br>
installed on the blog as well.<br>
<br>
-- <br>
Jeremy Clarke<br>
Code and Design | <a href="http://globalvoicesonline.org" target="_blank">globalvoicesonline.org</a><br>
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Have a great day,<br>Paris Vega<br><br>Graphic, Logo and Website Designer<br><a href="http://www.parisvega.com">www.parisvega.com</a><br><br><a href="mailto:paris@parisvega.com">paris@parisvega.com</a><br>
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